2018 1000-5 drops a cylinder at idle.

[Redtech]

Long story short I have done just about everything like dakotadrone has with the same symptoms except when switching the injector wires I was able to make the misfire transfer cylinders so I double checked my wires again going from the ECM to my injector wires, ohm tested, unwrapped loom, did a pull test, ohm wiggle test etc… and finally decided that it had to be coming from the ECM. Keep in mind I am the type of mechanic that tries to absolutely eliminate throwing ECM’s at things, so it’s my last resort but I put a new ECM in and everything runs just fine, just thought I would share that with everyone, hopefully it helps cause I have been pulling my hair out trying to figure this thing out!

Good for you not just throwing parts at it! Too many are just concerned about going fast, not doing it correctly. I tried swapping this PCM into a known good machine right away as they are known for screwing up the idle mapping for fuel injection if jump started from a running car or something like that with too much amperage. Also tried putting known good in this machine. Have a wire harness on order now for it. Honda engineering and techline says it's a voltage anomaly 😆. I did find another machine to swap the fan control module out of and made difference either.

 

[Admin]

 

[Red101]

Oppps sorry I guess Honda calls it a PGM-FI Unit. That’s what I think happened to this one with a jump start. Well I appreciate all the info you have posted cause it gave me some different ideas on how to solve the issue other than the obvious common fixes. Unplugging the regulator rectifier was the weirdest to me but since the engine load is taken away it can run flawlessly. Sorry to get off the subject but do they fill the regulator/rectifiers with oil? Both my 2016 1000-5 and the 2018 1000-5 I’m working on have oil residue in and on the plug for it?

 

[Hello_Darkness]

Oppps sorry I guess Honda calls it a PGM-FI Unit. That’s what I think happened to this one with a jump start. Well I appreciate all the info you have posted cause it gave me some different ideas on how to solve the issue other than the obvious common fixes. Unplugging the regulator rectifier was the weirdest to me but since the engine load is taken away it can run flawlessly. Sorry to get off the subject but do they fill the regulator/rectifiers with oil? Both my 2016 1000-5 and the 2018 1000-5 I’m working on have oil residue in and on the plug for it?

The oil is wicking up the harness into the connector

It's been an issue in the past

 

[Redtech]

Oppps sorry I guess Honda calls it a PGM-FI Unit. That’s what I think happened to this one with a jump start. Well I appreciate all the info you have posted cause it gave me some different ideas on how to solve the issue other than the obvious common fixes. Unplugging the regulator rectifier was the weirdest to me but since the engine load is taken away it can run flawlessly. Sorry to get off the subject but do they fill the regulator/rectifiers with oil? Both my 2016 1000-5 and the 2018 1000-5 I’m working on have oil residue in and on the plug for it?

Like Hello_Darkness said, the oil is traveling inside the wire insulation from stator up to the plug. They should be dry and sealed. In theory as long as the oil doesn't fill up enough in the plug to short the wires together it shouldn't cause an issue. BMW actually says residue is normal but if you disconnect the stator plug and oil runs out of it, it should be replaced. Was the weirdest thing to me when I first had it happen on a bike.

 

[Remington]

Long story short I have done just about everything like dakotadrone has with the same symptoms except when switching the injector wires I was able to make the misfire transfer cylinders so I double checked my wires again going from the ECM to my injector wires, ohm tested, unwrapped loom, did a pull test, ohm wiggle test etc… and finally decided that it had to be coming from the ECM. Keep in mind I am the type of mechanic that tries to absolutely eliminate throwing ECM’s at things, so it’s my last resort but I put a new ECM in and everything runs just fine, just thought I would share that with everyone, hopefully it helps cause I have been pulling my hair out trying to figure this thing out!

On what rig do u have?

Welcome from Michigan BTW

 

[Red101]

Like Hello_Darkness said, the oil is traveling inside the wire insulation from stator up to the plug. They should be dry and sealed. In theory as long as the oil doesn't fill up enough in the plug to short the wires together it shouldn't cause an issue. BMW actually says residue is normal but if you disconnect the stator plug and oil runs out of it, it should be replaced. Was the weirdest thing to me when I first had it happen on a bike.

Interesting, I had in mind since I had it in the stator plug that it may be like a transformer and filled with oil, but I guess I need to replace it. Remington I am working on a 2018 1000-5, but I own a 2016 1000-5

 

[Redtech]

Well final update of the nightmare repair. I got the approval for a complete harness got it installed and after about 5 minutes it dropped the front cylinder again. I spent another 5 minutes bagging my head on the wall and inventing a few mew curse words. After that I went back to step one and hooked up MCS to see if my average MAP was still super high. To my amazement it was actually reading like it should now, in low to mid 60's all the time but noticed O2 was flat and not jumping around like it should. Before i just attributed it to the MAP reading causing the excess fuel an what not since unplugging it and swapping didnt a difference before. Went an found we had a couple good running machines traded in recently waiting to go through shop so I pulled one in to be my guinea pig and donor machine. Decided to a comparison data recording on this machine and watched the O2 voltage work like it should an decide to swap pcm first as it was easiest even though I had tried swapping 4 other times to appease techline. Turns out I had a bad MAP circuit in the harness and a bad O2 circuit in the PCM. Got the new PCM installed, clutches initialized, and now thing runs great. Have put about 3.5 hours on it slow speed and idling to verify. Now on to the next nightmare. Thanks everyone for ideas and input along the way.

 

[DRZRon1]

outstanding followup

for clarity - whats a bad MAP circuit in the harness mean?

so harness and PCM were both bad at the end of the day?

 

[Redtech]

Yes it took both the PCM and new harness to fix it. The bad MAP circuit I just a way of saying I had an issue on the manifold air pressure signal line. I personally feel it was some sort of interference.

 

[DRZRon1]

Yes it took both the PCM and new harness to fix it. The bad MAP circuit I just a way of saying I had an issue on the manifold air pressure signal line. I personally feel it was some sort of interference.

I hear ya - fingers crossed here as well

 

[DG Rider]

@dakotadrone did you ever get a chance to look at this one...

P700 - EPS recall done + fuel pump. Now it dies when driving.

Got my 19' 700 back from dealership yesterday. It stalled twice at idle in the dealership driveway. EPS Light came on both times. Could not get it to die a third time, EPS Light was off on restart. Against my better judgement, I brought it home. It died 5 times in 3 miles, varying RPM/SPEED...

hondasxs.com

Seems like a new one pops up on FB every week.

 

[Jerryg]

Well final update of the nightmare repair. I got the approval for a complete harness got it installed and after about 5 minutes it dropped the front cylinder again. I spent another 5 minutes bagging my head on the wall and inventing a few mew curse words. After that I went back to step one and hooked up MCS to see if my average MAP was still super high. To my amazement it was actually reading like it should now, in low to mid 60's all the time but noticed O2 was flat and not jumping around like it should. Before i just attributed it to the MAP reading causing the excess fuel an what not since unplugging it and swapping didnt a difference before. Went an found we had a couple good running machines traded in recently waiting to go through shop so I pulled one in to be my guinea pig and donor machine. Decided to a comparison data recording on this machine and watched the O2 voltage work like it should an decide to swap pcm first as it was easiest even though I had tried swapping 4 other times to appease techline. Turns out I had a bad MAP circuit in the harness and a bad O2 circuit in the PCM. Got the new PCM installed, clutches initialized, and now thing runs great. Have put about 3.5 hours on it slow speed and idling to verify. Now on to the next nightmare. Thanks everyone for ideas and input along the way.

Sell it.............run away.................buy a Yamaha.

 

[ChadD]

Sell it.............run away.................buy a Yamaha.

View attachment 1000004835.webp

 

[Jerryg]

View attachment 438733

 

[Redtech]

@dakotadrone did you ever get a chance to look at this one...

P700 - EPS recall done + fuel pump. Now it dies when driving.

Got my 19' 700 back from dealership yesterday. It stalled twice at idle in the dealership driveway. EPS Light came on both times. Could not get it to die a third time, EPS Light was off on restart. Against my better judgement, I brought it home. It died 5 times in 3 miles, varying RPM/SPEED...

hondasxs.com

Seems like a new one pops up on FB every week.

I read through it again last night. Did I not read correctly but thought it sounded like all you guys had it fixed after ground issues or new harnesses? Towards the end, the post about speed sensors. I actually just had one at work the other day that front speed sensor signal error caused machine to stall out in gear for some reason. Can't wrap my head around why that would matter with engine runnability.

 

[DRZRon1]

I read through it again last night. Did I not read correctly but thought it sounded like all you guys had it fixed after ground issues or new harnesses? Towards the end, the post about speed sensors. I actually just had one at work the other day that front speed sensor signal error caused machine to stall out in gear for some reason. Can't wrap my head around why that would matter with engine runnability.

whats maddening to me is - there is zero explanation of the logic inside of the ECM's - it exists - someone at the sub-contractor wrote the code for Honda. I come from the opposite side of the control world - industrial control world - every machine PLC - contact a laptop up and watch the code live Including all the raw data from pressure\temp\speed sensors - no matter how long the code has been stable, and it could be years - - we always find a bug int the program - usually when the equipment is crashed - lol

 

[DG Rider]

I read through it again last night. Did I not read correctly but thought it sounded like all you guys had it fixed after ground issues or new harnesses? Towards the end, the post about speed sensors. I actually just had one at work the other day that front speed sensor signal error caused machine to stall out in gear for some reason. Can't wrap my head around why that would matter with engine runnability.

It does seem like that is fixing it, but I was just wondering if Honda has said anything.

The 700's...the older ones at least, only have one speed sensor, and it doesn't seem like it's causing the issue.

 

[Redtech]

No I haven't seen anything from honda regarding it.

 

[DG Rider]

No I haven't seen anything from honda regarding it.

Please let us know if you do. Thanks for keeping us updated.