ToddACimer
Pioneer 1005-2
Lifetime Member
It's interesting that you mention that but, as I found out the stock rear springs have significant preload on them. I just finished putting it back together and I have the new numbers.
ToddACimer
Pioneer 1005-2
Lifetime Member
Alright so the springs are back on and much to my surprise the machine is much softer but the setup is very different.
For shocks I set this up with basically zero preload to allow me to put them back on the Talon and seek the same ride height. I'm really going for a trail machine with soft ride. I have arched a-arms and full skids and a plan for 32s.
For the front I had about 2" of travel in the adjustment nuts to get to my initial preload. This led to a low nose and we adjusted them to 4" to sit at the stock preload. I also set the cross over rings with 1.25" of up travel. It's worth noting the bandit springs are 1.5" shorter so despite an initial preload position of 3" with the stock springs we actually have less preload.
For the rear, I had to compress the springs a bit to put them on so I knew I was only going to have a light preload. I ended up with 1.5" of preload. This nailed the initial loaded ride height (+1/4").
The front gained 5/8" but the slope along the chassis also improved with a about 3/4" delta between the front and rear wheels lower in the rear.
One thing to note is our static sag at normal payload was 40-45% and since we maintained ride height for the most part and kept the payload the same, I really didn't change that, despite a lot less preload compared to the stock springs.
I'm pretty happy and our quick test ride off the road, through the ditch and jumping the culvert was very very nice.
For shocks I set this up with basically zero preload to allow me to put them back on the Talon and seek the same ride height. I'm really going for a trail machine with soft ride. I have arched a-arms and full skids and a plan for 32s.
For the front I had about 2" of travel in the adjustment nuts to get to my initial preload. This led to a low nose and we adjusted them to 4" to sit at the stock preload. I also set the cross over rings with 1.25" of up travel. It's worth noting the bandit springs are 1.5" shorter so despite an initial preload position of 3" with the stock springs we actually have less preload.
For the rear, I had to compress the springs a bit to put them on so I knew I was only going to have a light preload. I ended up with 1.5" of preload. This nailed the initial loaded ride height (+1/4").
The front gained 5/8" but the slope along the chassis also improved with a about 3/4" delta between the front and rear wheels lower in the rear.
One thing to note is our static sag at normal payload was 40-45% and since we maintained ride height for the most part and kept the payload the same, I really didn't change that, despite a lot less preload compared to the stock springs.
I'm pretty happy and our quick test ride off the road, through the ditch and jumping the culvert was very very nice.
Good stuff - just can’t for the life of me wrap my head around much stiffer springs giving a softer ride😂.
Yeh - the ride height is maddening - I went down the bandit road day 1 and shocks on/off getting it dialed in.
When in had springs off if I recall correctly I could not compress shock shaft with my fat ass - eventually got the revalve/new springs/caps done.
Hope I can be more educated about this stuff at some point - lol.
ToddACimer
Pioneer 1005-2
Lifetime Member
The biggest difference is that under the static load of the machine, the stiffer spring isn't completely collapsed. That's combined with a huge reduction in preload. By reducing preload it takes less force to further compress the spring. In this case despite stiffer springs, the setup allows for compression with less force input so it rides better especially at low speed. Theres a chance that I'll need to adjust the cross over rings if I have issues bottoming out. By removing the tender spring with the cross over ring engagement, I can stiffen up the spring rate for bigger impacts. I'm looking forward to playing with it a bit more
ToddACimer
Pioneer 1005-2
Lifetime Member
Got a box of parts in the mail today.
Bosman bumper to go with my Traveler 4500 winch. I'll have to get a few lights for it. I went with the traveler because the install is clean and the wireless remote control is great. Looking forward to installing it later this week.
Bosman bumper to go with my Traveler 4500 winch. I'll have to get a few lights for it. I went with the traveler because the install is clean and the wireless remote control is great. Looking forward to installing it later this week.
ToddACimer
Pioneer 1005-2
Lifetime Member
Bumper looks good and the winch was easy to wire up.
I fought the lower passenger side mount for too long. The stock bumper was caved in and it turns out the mount was tweaked and pushed back. I hammered it somewhat straight with the air hammer but not perfect. It's not the first or the last bruise.
I fought the lower passenger side mount for too long. The stock bumper was caved in and it turns out the mount was tweaked and pushed back. I hammered it somewhat straight with the air hammer but not perfect. It's not the first or the last bruise.
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