Talon i4wd swapped to manual lockers

[snuffnwhisky]

That video is torque management. If the clutch engages much more, it will kill the motor. Thats not a 4wd issue. Just need lower gearing.

 

[Admin]

 

[Alan_Vander]

That video is torque management. If the clutch engages much more, it will kill the motor. Thats not a 4wd issue. Just need lower gearing.

Yeah but there is one on portals with 45% reduction in the same hole doing same thing. To me Almost feels like honda shot themselves in the foot on this one. So heres what we will make a machine that has not belt but where youd burn or slip a belt we also cant go. And i dont like that cause my 700 breezes through holes like this.

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[Plumber32]

Yeah but there is one on portals with 45% reduction in the same hole doing same thing. To me Almost feels like honda shot themselves in the foot on this one. So heres what we will make a machine that has not belt but where youd burn or slip a belt we also cant go. And i dont like that cause my 700 breezes through holes like this.

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Yes it does!

 

[snuffnwhisky]

Yeah but there is one on portals with 45% reduction in the same hole doing same thing. To me Almost feels like honda shot themselves in the foot on this one. So heres what we will make a machine that has not belt but where youd burn or slip a belt we also cant go. And i dont like that cause my 700 breezes through holes like this.

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A talon with 45% portals in low, first gear is still about 30% taller geared than a KRX in low, stock. A good tune can help get the wheels spinning in a pioneer or talon, lots of ignition timing pulled down low.

 

[Alan_Vander]

A talon with 45% portals in low, first gear is still about 30% taller geared than a KRX in low, stock. A good tune can help get the wheels spinning in a pioneer or talon, lots of ignition timing pulled down low.

Yeah but 45% with 37s is about like running 25s on these. Its actually less of tire size than that but add in rotating weight and that would be the equivalent. This is the thing im trying to figure out why this happens. And what can fix it. Cause these machines should be turning them in this situation. It actually does in 2wd but wont in 4wd unless its already moving.

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[Plumber32]

Yeah but 45% with 37s is about like running 25s on these. Its actually less of tire size than that but add in rotating weight and that would be the equivalent. This is the thing im trying to figure out why this happens. And what can fix it. Cause these machines should be turning them in this situation. It actually does in 2wd but wont in 4wd unless its already moving.

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What if on dry ground you hook to a tree with the talon. Will it spin? Or only if you bump it? Or either.

 

[CumminsPusher]

What if on dry ground you hook to a tree with the talon. Will it spin? Or only if you bump it? Or either.

Pioneer spun from a dead stop after hooking to my stuck camper the last weekend up but its was diff lock machine. Smoked both right side tires.

 

[SuperATV]

I'm watching this too. We're playing with it right now.

 

[Alan_Vander]

What if on dry ground you hook to a tree with the talon. Will it spin? Or only if you bump it? Or either.

Not sure but i have a feeling the i4wd is not just tuned to the brakes. I have a feeling its an added bit into the throttle as well aka throttle at 50% vs front shaft sensors not registering a certain rpm then kicking it out. Id really like to see the pioneer i4wd and manual comparison to see if it is the i 4wd or the torque management. Thats the only true way i could think of seeing if it is tied in the way i think it might be. And if it is and thats what is shutting it down how do you bypass that part alone.
But it kinda comes down to when we were riding at rrb. When i had to play anchor just because of my tires on the hill. Which is also where i noticed my power drop from the altitude. Yall could spin them all day right there but thats just slick and yalls tires wasnt made for that specific terrain. I have rode with a few 1k since then and they are getting it with tires like mine same size and 25% reduction. But i have yet to see someone with i4wd around me besides the talons.

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[Montecresto]

I'm watching this too. We're playing with it right now.

Meaning you’re working on it?

 

[SuperATV]

Meaning you’re working on it?

This is too fun to call it work.

 

[snuffnwhisky]

Not sure but i have a feeling the i4wd is not just tuned to the brakes. I have a feeling its an added bit into the throttle as well aka throttle at 50% vs front shaft sensors not registering a certain rpm then kicking it out. Id really like to see the pioneer i4wd and manual comparison to see if it is the i 4wd or the torque management. Thats the only true way i could think of seeing if it is tied in the way i think it might be. And if it is and thats what is shutting it down how do you bypass that part alone.
But it kinda comes down to when we were riding at rrb. When i had to play anchor just because of my tires on the hill. Which is also where i noticed my power drop from the altitude. Yall could spin them all day right there but thats just slick and yalls tires wasnt made for that specific terrain. I have rode with a few 1k since then and they are getting it with tires like mine same size and 25% reduction. But i have yet to see someone with i4wd around me besides the talons.

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A diff-lock pioneer with 30"+ tires will do the same as the video if you get all the tires bound up good. Basically just bog and not want to move. The I4WD doesn't come into play if none of the tires are moving. In the Dynojet Powervision 3, you can see and adjust the Engine Torque map (Talon ECU) and the more throttle you give the machine without the rpm going up, the more ignition timing is pulled out, reducing power (Worse with the pioneer than the talon). In mud, you have the suction effect and its covering a lot larger surface area of the tire. With the DCT, the clutch starts locking up right off idle, theres not a whole lot of power being made there vs a belt machine being able to rev up some and get more into the meat of the powerband.

 

[Alan_Vander]

I never should of asked this. Yes i know about suction and how it works. But the more and more yall are telling me about these machines the less i want onenone of the machines i know of with 30 or over are without either portals or igr as far as around me. That i know of. that are doing this. But i also havent seen anything but the talon doing it.

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[Patron1960]

I am about to do my first oil change on my 2020 Pioneer 1000-5 LE and I was told to only use Honda oil due to the tranny using the motor oil as tranny fluid. Now this was a dealer telling me that so it may be marketing! I want to use auto synthetic oil and just want to ask?

 

[Patron1960]

I am about to do my first oil change on my 2020 Pioneer 1000-5 LE and I was told to only use Honda oil due to the tranny using the motor oil as tranny fluid. Now this was a dealer telling me that so it may be marketing! I want to use auto synthetic oil and just want to ask?

I thought this was a new post so sorry it’s in the wrong thread!

 

[Bohnt10]

A diff-lock pioneer with 30"+ tires will do the same as the video if you get all the tires bound up good. Basically just bog and not want to move. The I4WD doesn't come into play if none of the tires are moving. In the Dynojet Powervision 3, you can see and adjust the Engine Torque map (Talon ECU) and the more throttle you give the machine without the rpm going up, the more ignition timing is pulled out, reducing power (Worse with the pioneer than the talon). In mud, you have the suction effect and its covering a lot larger surface area of the tire. With the DCT, the clutch starts locking up right off idle, theres not a whole lot of power being made there vs a belt machine being able to rev up some and get more into the meat of the powerband.

This just happened to me this past weekend at Wildcat. Got bound up on rocks at the corners and couldn’t spin the tires. Managed to get it free, but it way harder than it should’ve been....

 

[Talon4TW]

I need someone to help me make a override for the 4x4. Im 99% sure it will work as i expect. Just need a test dummy.

What we will do is engage the 4x4 but not the i4wd.

I'm not sure how it will function in reguards to the i4wd at that point. I don't have a talon to test on.

It plugs into the front diff and you will need to supply 12v and maybe a ground.

Hi
If you still need someone to test it, I would like to do it.

 

[Killer223]

i'm not much help on the current issue, but i'm here to say my Talon has defueled or shut down like you are describing. i was crawling up some loose and rocky sections, it wigged out and shut down on me. and i had to role back about 2 feet and give it the gusto to make it up it. i wasn't able to stop mid way and "crawl" up the ledge. i actually thought it was going to role on me. from then on i don't crawl or stop anywhere a tire can spin. i make sure it is moving and get the juice on before and no issue.
i could hear the engine burp kinda like bouncing off the revlimiter. but i was at the just off idle.
so i'm here to confirm the shuit down issue. but i'm of no help in why it does it. i has happened to me 3-4 times.

 

[Sheetmetalfab]

I think it’s just the limitation of dct.
slow crawl doesn’t have the torque for extreme loads.

cvt can rev then engage with the meat of the power. (Then slip, wear and blow belts) learn to work with it and pick your poison.

 

[jasond]

I need someone to help me make a override for the 4x4. Im 99% sure it will work as i expect. Just need a test dummy.

What we will do is engage the 4x4 but not the i4wd.

I'm not sure how it will function in reguards to the i4wd at that point. I don't have a talon to test on.

It plugs into the front diff and you will need to supply 12v and maybe a ground.

I'm curious to see what you come up with as well as the results.